Bar Mandatory?

DarkCSE · Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 10:30 pm Post subject: Bar Mandatory?

Hi guys, I'm a long time DDR player-ITG convert, and I was wondering is it actually required to use the bar? It seems like on things like pandemonium expert you NEED it whereas in DDR the Max songs you could get by w/o.

Alezay · Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 10:46 pm Post subject:

I'm assuming you haven't seen the videos of Pickles and others passing Pandemonium Expert with no bar. We've all had enough of the bar vs. no bar threads. Choose which one you like, and do it.
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DarkCSE · Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:07 pm Post subject:

Nope; I haven't seen any vids where hte people haven't used the bar. As for the like or dislike, the question was just on mandatory usage not preference. Thanks for the response though.

Thomas Hobbes · Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:41 pm Post subject:

It is not required to use the bar then. Like Alezay previously said, Pickles has passed the 13 on ITG1 without the usage of the bar. There is even a video of it to prove it.

However, a lot of my friends and players that I know (most of Team BluR) use the bar for everything. I, personally, use the bar for everything. It could be a 1 or a 13, I'd have to use the bar. This is because without the bar, I wouldn't be able to read at high speeds, as I'd most likely fall over trying. My FA is best optimized at high speeds, so I am able to use the high speeds in conjunction with the bar.

Therefore, the bar is a must-have for me.
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DarkCSE · Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 3:46 am Post subject:

heh, I'll have to find that video. It's just from the ones i've seen, it seemed like the bar was necessary to keep your feet from breaking

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DarkCSE · Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:24 pm Post subject:

Much appreciated. Thanks.

Rancidfish · Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:43 pm Post subject:

Also, a lot of songs use hands, which sort of force you to let go of either some holds (and get a lower score) or the bar (to use your hands)... so they obviously didn't expect everybody to always use the bar. Also, when shown some PIU nightmare charts and asked to give them ITG ratings, mjemerizan commented "Some of these look outright uncombo-able without the bar, which goes against ITG design mentality" (or something along those lines, I'm paraphrasing), so they obviously didn't expect the bar to be mandatory for harder songs.

All in all... bar or no bar, it's up to you. Also, that last paragraph had far too many parenthetical asides.
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Thomas Hobbes · Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:13 am Post subject:

Uh, usually hands are isolated well enough so that I can get down and do them to keep my score/FA up. If not, I cheat.
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J. S. Mill · Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:59 am Post subject:

It depends on what you mean by mandatory: can you pass things without the bar? Yeah sure.

Does it make the game much, much, much easier to play and score? Yeah, it does.

Is it mandatory to use it to score 9's and some 10's? No.

Is it mandatory for a tournament player emphasizing consistency and versatility on 11's and 12's? Yeah, I think it is.
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sniperman99 · Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:03 pm Post subject:

It depends on your preference i guess.
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djzmudpony · Trick Member Joined: 11 Nov 2003 Location: Edison, NJ

I've seen people at 8otB use the bar and heel/toe the hands (as long as they aren't holds) and still get the hands to register. I'm assuming you need shoes with thinner, bendable bottoms.

On another note, I'm seen plenty of people play 11's and 12's without the bar. I'm sure it makes it much easier (and less tiring) to use the bar, but it's definitely not mandatory to use the bar.
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469.JR07 Si · Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:15 pm Post subject:

Rancidfish · Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:59 pm Post subject:

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djzmudpony · Trick Member Joined: 11 Nov 2003 Location: Edison, NJ

I was playing around with quickly hitting the hand note while in the middle of jump hold. I'm sure this is old news, but I found ITG will still register that you're stepping on the hold as long as you get your foot back to the hold really fast. I suppose it's similar to how you could shuffle your steps around while holding a freeze in DDR.
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tac-tics · Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 7:32 am Post subject:

As wide as the jump window is, it's our only compensation for those damn step-step-into-jumps the ITG stepfilists love. Really, on DDR's timing, Tell Fullcombo would be impossible!
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DarkCSE · Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 9:23 am Post subject:

hehe well, I've deemed the bar sorta neccessary. Due to lack of flexibility, I gotta grab the bar for the weird hand hits.... As for the the lvl 13 songs, we'll see when I get there.

FKK.Carrot · Trick Member Joined: 07 May 2005

I always use the bar, if not it just feels odd and I lose my balence, use more energy and or hit the wrong steps for some reason. Plus the bar helps me on my timeing. Somtimes, if I know a song well enough, on parts that feel confterable and my arms are tired I will let go for part of the song, then go back on once I need it. And that video is truely awesome, it is cool if you look at his top half and see it hardly moving (besides his arms of cource) then look at the bottom half and see it doing all that work. Must have been tireing

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JimTheFly · Staff Member Joined: 22 Jan 2002 Location: Bayonne, NJ

It's a personal preference issue, as always. I tend to use the bar more with ITG than DDR because there are parts that are harder for me to do and/or move into without the added balance I get from using it. And when it comes to Doubles, it really helps me maintain balance on some of the transfers which would otherwise cause me a good bit of problems. As far as NEEDING the bar... well, I'm sure that once you get used to the song, you could do so without the bar.

As far as the windows go, I was playing some song (can't remember which) and there was a 16th/8th pairing (beginning of Robotix Hard, maybe?) and so I figured "Okay, triple." I ended up with a Fantastic/Way Off, because it read the 1/4th note that I added in as an extremely early attempt to get the 1/8th. So I've found that I've got to be a bit more cognizant of when and where I add my steps.

Concerning holds: I've seen the size of ITG's hold-continuation window. LSBE manages to get the hands during the earlier parts of Energizer Doubles Expert by simply coming off the holds and executing them as jumps. He gets the hands and the holds almost every time register as being completed.

Gallopjumps: I've seen Chef do Energy Normal so many times, *I* could almost recite the mods by heart (something he, at least at one point, was able to do with 100% accuracy with both the timing and the mod+percentage combos, IIRC), and at the end of Liquid Moon, there's a step-jump-step-jump-step-jump set of steps. His method of getting them was step-gallop-step-gallop, etc. A great example of the size of the jump window.
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